Gupta’s stunning deal to supply cheap solar to South Australian industry | RenewEconomy

Gupta’s stunning deal to supply cheap solar to South Australian industry

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UK “green steel” billioinaire Sanjeev Gupta has unveiled a stunning, landmark agreement to provide cheap solar power to five major South Australian companies, promising to slash their electricity costs by up to 50 per cent.

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Sanjeev Gupta and Rebecca Knol from the South Australia Chamber of Mines and Energy.

UK “green steel” billionaire Sanjeev Gupta has unveiled a stunning, landmark agreement to provide cheap solar power to five major South Australian companies, promising to slash their electricity costs by up to 50 per cent.

The eight-year deal signed with a consortium brought together by the SA Chamber of Mines and Energy (SACOME) – and including some of the heavy hitters in the resources industry – will enable Gupta’s SIMEC ZEN Energy to fast track the construction of the 220MW Cultana solar farm near Whyalla.

The eight-year supply deal is the just latest in a flood of contracts between large energy users and solar companies to slash their electricity costs by sourcing power directly from their own or third-party solar farms.

Just in the past few weeks, companies such as CUB, Mars Australia, and University of Queensland have signed contracts to meet all their electricity needs with large-scale solar plants, and others such as zinc refiner Sun Metals, Telstra and CC Amatil will use solar and/or wind to supply a large part of their needs.

Gupta’s deal is doubly significant, because it is the start of his own plans to create an Australian solar-powered economy, with plans to build 10GW of large-scale solar to slash the energy costs of his own manufacturing businesses and others.

It is also another stake in the heart of the coal industry and their apostles in the right wing of the Coalition, whose claim that only coal power can deliver cheap and reliable energy is looking more ridiculous by the day.

“We wanted energy affordability, energy reliability and energy security, and this deal with SIMEC ZEN Energy delivers all three,” Rebecca Knol, the CEO of SACOME, told RenewEconomy.

Knol kicked off the plans for a corporate bulk-buy of renewable power way back in 2016, in response to wholesale electricity prices that she describes as the highest and most volatile in Australia, if not the world.

Out of 20 businesses that became part of a corporate bulk-buy purchasing group, with the blessing of the ACCC – as long as it resulted in new generation – five businesses have signed up, including leading miner Hillgrove Resources and retailer Foodland.

The others are copper mine and carbonate producer Adchem, storage and handling group Viterra, and the Central Irrigation Trust, the largest irrigation infrastructure operator in South Australia.

Since launching its “baseload” renewables product, SIMEC ZEN has inked retail power supply deals with the South Australian government and a Victorian steel mill, and installed solar across four shopping centres in Adelaide.

“This is a landmark deal – a first of its kind – and is expected to inspire a host of similar initiatives across the country,” the two groups said in a join media statement on Friday.

“This outcome demonstrates what can be achieved when businesses decide as a collective that the status quo is not acceptable,” said Gupta.

“Ultimately what is needed to fix the energy market in this state is more competition in wholesale generation and retailing – this result delivers both.”

Indeed, while South Australia’s high and volatile power prices have been blamed by conservatives and ideologues as the fault of renewables, in reality the state has always experienced such high prices, even causing the state grid provider to investigate wind energy more than half a century ago.

Now it is patently clear that wind and solar – combined with the plunging cost of storage and the emergence of “firming contracts” – is easily beating fossil fuel generation as the most reliable source of cheap energy.

The expected bill savings from the customers of 20 to 50 per cent were from the “firm” solar contracts – i.e. backed up with storage or other sources – not just the solar power purchase agreement.

“While delivering SACOME members with electricity at a price below what could be achieved through a standard market tender, this contract also allows SIMEC ZEN Energy to fast track plans to replace the capacity lost when the Northern Power Station closed two years ago,” Gupta said.

“This capacity will be a mix of generation assets suited to the new energy landscape, such as the Cultana Solar Power Station and our other projects in the Upper Spencer Gulf.”

Those projects include an 80MW solar farm that will be installed “behind the meter” near the Whyalla steelworks, a massive pumped hydro facility in an old iron ore mine in the Middleback Ranges, and a massive 120MW/140MWh lithium-ion battery in Port Augusta.

A “sod-turning” ceremony is anticipated in the next week or two at Whyalla for two solar farms, with completion due in the third quarter of 2019. The contracted supply begin on July 1 next year.

In all, Gupta plans 1GW of large-scale solar in South Australia alone, and plans to sign up more business customers. For an insight into his plans, please read the story published earlier today: Inside Sanjeev Gupta’s plans to create Australia’s solar-powered economy.

SIMEC ZEN director Ross Garnaut told RenewEconomy that SIMEC ZEN had been working for some time to supply GFG  and other users of power with firm contracts, backed by renewables and storage.

“We secured through competitive tender the supply of the south Australia goernment late last year. This is a continuation of the roll out of that strategy. It confirms the competitive of that product that SIMEC Zen is able to put together.”

And are there more deals to come?  “We’re talking to a lot of people and it’s all going pretty well,” Garnaut said.

Knol said that with electricity representing up to 40 per cent of input costs for the group’s members, savings could be redistributed to new business investment opportunities for the state’s economy.

“This cross-sectoral collaboration has delivered affordable power to some of South Australia’s largest energy users and underpinned the development of new supply for the collective benefit of state,” Knol said.

“Following the Australian Competition and Consumer Commission’s (ACCC) green light in May 2017, SACOME’s flagship joint-purchasing electricity group banded together to leverage their strength in numbers and bring down electricity prices for their businesses.

“The group’s approach to this complex commercial negotiation in a fast-changing electricity environment has been inspirational.

“The outcome is a credit to the stamina and commitment of our participating members* who represent a diverse slice of South Australian business,” she said.

Know told RenewEconomy that she expected other members of the business community in South Australia to join the buying consortium.

Steven McClare, CEO and managing director of Hillgrove, said the contract will provide electricity purchase security during unforgiving price peaks. “This stability enhances the role that Hillgrove can play ingrowing South Australia’s copper production.”

Adchrm’s managing Director, Mark Woodhead said: “Electricity costs are a substantial portion of our total cost to manufacture value added copper chemicals on a large scale. This contract represents a positive long-term outcome to secure electricity supply at acompetitive price.”

Update: In a statement, the ACCC said it welcomes the announcement, pointing to the advantage of increased competition in the S.A. market, which is dominated by AGL, and two other retailers.

“The ACCC authorised SACOME members to go to market to find a more competitive supplier of electricity. We did this because, as a group, they had a better chance of securing supply from a new source of generation that would bring new competition to the market,” ACCC Chair Rod Sims said.

“We are pleased that SACOME has been successful in its efforts to sponsor new generation capacity in South Australia, and source a lower price for electricity for its members. New independent generation capacity is critical to improving competition and helping bring down electricity prices,” Sims said.

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  1. Cooma Doug 2 years ago

    Really good news

  2. John Saint-Smith 2 years ago

    “We wanted energy affordability, energy reliability and energy security, and this deal with SIMEC ZEN Energy delivers all three,” Rebecca Knol, the CEO of SACOME, told RenewEconomy.

    And Effingberg will be lining up to take the credit for that too!

    When will the rest of the business community wake up to the LNP ideological stupidity that has already cost them $billions?

    • Gus Griffin 2 years ago

      It may not be costing them as much as you think. Koch et al worldwide are shelling out billions each year to subsidize “business as usual”. We can only hope it eventually breaks them as more and more “customers” desert the sinking ship (like the consortium above) in spite of all the bribes.

      • John Saint-Smith 2 years ago

        Koch can’t stop reality. We only have one earth, but it’s dying. You can’t make a buck on a dead planet. That’s what they’re losing, and they’re taking us with them.

        • Miles Harding 2 years ago

          They don’t care and they’d suck the blood out of a dead corpse.

          • John Saint-Smith 2 years ago

            We don’t need to descend to vampire myths, as amusing as you might think it is.

  3. Brian Tehan 2 years ago

    Excellent. Make this man an Australian citizen. We could certainly do with a billionaire who has foresight and cares about the environment. He’s creating jobs as well as giving our energy and manufacturing a good push into the 21st century .

    • Greg Hudson 2 years ago

      Is this the same Gupta renowned for that huge new coal mine in Qld ?

      • handbaskets'r'us 2 years ago


      • Carl Raymond S 2 years ago

        Rajesh (fin controller, Adani), unrelated to Sanjeev, afaik. Gupta is not uncommon in India. Sanjeev was educated in Cambridge.

    • tnomail 2 years ago

      Citizen? How about PM?

    • My_Oath 2 years ago

      And he is showing the trogdolites that doing this is sound, profitable business.

      This is, I feel, the most important part of all. Energy transition isn’t going to happen by magic. It will happen by economics. By demonstrating the economic case to business – right now – he is doing two things. First, is the stitch in time saves nine principle. Second, by demonstrating the compelling business case, he erodes the support the coal-trolls garner by showing them to be the liars that they are, and showing them in a way that works best, with the bottom line.

    • Warren 2 years ago

      Gupta should be made a citizen or our PM; really?

      Isn’t it amazing that Gupta can arrive down-under and out-smart the smartest
      Australian businesses! Wow he’s smarter than AGL, Alinta, Pacific Hydro Au
      (Chinese) etc isn’t he . . .

      No he’s not smarter, he’s a major donor to State and Federal Liberal and Labor and
      the Minerals Council of Australia.

      He’s also a multinational so he’ll pay on company tax here; just like the majority of multinationals operating in Australia.

      He can do this deal specifically due to corruption.

      This deal will ultimately come under scrutiny by 2025 in a Royal Commission into
      Australia’s electricity market.

  4. Phil NSW 2 years ago

    I understand the ACCC has endorsed this agreement. It means these defections from the standard grid purchasing process will cause the remaining network users to bear a higher share of the cost of supply. Will the last man in the room turn out the lights please?

    • Rhys Lloyd 2 years ago

      Umm… the power isn’t wireless. It still needs to get from the generation to the destination. The retailers don’t run the transmission or distribution lines.

    • Gus Griffin 2 years ago

      It’s a sinking ship you’re on, Phil. Time to scurry down the hawser and find some other worthy cause to crap on. Though I imagine the pay is still good.

      • Phil NSW 2 years ago

        I am sorry Gus you think that way.
        As more and more people and companies do something about high electricity prices (and they should) it means those who choose not to or can not are left to bear the cost. If you think this is not worthy of mention then you have had your say. Have a look at a similar comment made by the Chief Executive of the Australian Energy Market Operator, Audrey Zibelman. It was reported on 25 April this year.

        • Rod 2 years ago

          It doesn’t have to be that way though.
          For no more than the cost of BAU Government can install PV on social housing, as they are starting to do in QLD and SA.
          That leaves rentals. For suitable premises, Government could incentivise landlords via accelerated depreciation.
          Granted most apartments lack the real estate to install their own PV but offsite community solar farms could be one option.
          Remembering apartments with shared walls, ceilings etc. generally have much lower energy use.
          We are at a crossroads. We either reward people for staying on grid or suffer defections which will increase the transmission and distribution costs for those remaining on it.

        • Gus Griffin 2 years ago

          That makes perfect sense. We must all keep on doing the wrong thing so that it won’r be quite as expensive for the people who want to keep on doing the wrong thing. I’m paying you the compliment of accusing you of being morally bankrupt because I can’t believe anyone could be that monumentally stupid.

          • Phil NSW 2 years ago

            A slagging match with someone who can read and consequently not understand what is being said appears pointless. My patients is being tested. Please have another attempt to comprehend what has been said (if you have the time).

          • Gus Griffin 2 years ago

            I’ve been watching people like you come up with bogus reasons not to embrace clean energy for 30 years now – and that is the only point all your mis-spelt words are trying to make, Phil. If you have a better way to implement the changeover to clean energy – then articulate it – if not, then desist from confusing the issue.

          • Phil NSW 2 years ago

            Honestly, you yet again demonstrated you have not read my comments. Have a look at mine (check your own spelling while your there) and then others responses to my post. They understand the point. You seem hell bent on denigrating me without realising I absolutely support the advance of RE. I have articulated this consistently in reply to this story and many others. For the last time, read and understand before fire off your pistol. The bullet is only going through your own foot.

          • Gus Griffin 2 years ago

            Regardless of intent, your original comment re ACCC conveyed concern for those who would have to pay more. Your next reply re AEMO reinforced this impression. Neither of these express encouraging the adoption of renewal energy. Sorry, but I didn’t misunderstand the words expressed, you mis-communicated. If you meant to say something different, you failed. In future I suggest you check your compositions first with a friend to make sure they say what you mean.

        • Vox 2 years ago

          “The head of energy transmission company TransGrid, Paul Italiano, said the rise of rooftop solar was paving the way for the future but there needed to be tariff reform to better reflect how energy was being used in each home.”

          • Phil NSW 2 years ago

            Yes Vox, the rise in solar at this stage appears unstoppable. I am part of that rise and reap the benefits. I hope for all it continues. The system operators need to see this as their challenge and manage it to insure the system remains viable whilst it is required. Acknowledge there is an issue is at least a start down the right road.

        • neroden 2 years ago

          So those who choose not to are idiots, and they will eventually choose to get their own solar panels and batteries.

          Those who “can’t do something about high electricity prices” because they’re poor will eventually get solar panels and batteries, courtesy of the South Australian government which is busy installing them on subsidized housing. Haven’t you read?

          Other states could do the same thing.

  5. Jason Van Der Velden 2 years ago

    Sad that it takes a foreigner to have such national vision. This could be a major turn around for the australian service and manufacturing sectors. But quite frankly, he had me at the part where the lnp and attached coal huggers lost their minds as well as their bribes.

  6. Gary Rowbottom 2 years ago

    Yippee! Way to Go Sanjeev!

  7. Patrick Comerford 2 years ago

    Looks like the rats are jumping ship. Maybe they have had enough of the ideology crap coming from the Buisiness Council of Australia and the Minerales Council and have finally woken up that their employer organizations have been leading them over a cliff. It takes disrupters like Musk and Gupta to drag them into the twenty first century.

  8. Shilo 2 years ago

    A huge amount of details are missing from this.
    But the more that can be done by solar the better for the environment, well depending on how the “Actual” of doing it, is done.
    The “Actual” is a lot like the “devil” when getting into the detail of things.

  9. DugS 2 years ago

    Funny thing, there was the story in the Oz about the NSW coal generators tripping and all because of renewable energy eating coal powers lunch, yet nowhere was there any mention of this story. And what a powerful message. Here is the CEO of the SA Council of Mines and Energy, the little brother of the Minerals Council Australia, happily standing next to SG after signing the PPA for green energy, in complete contrast to the ‘green energy doesn’t work for heavy industry’ message in the Oz story.

    • Chris Drongers 2 years ago

      Even the Oz articles about the trips on coal fired plant and transmission were half-hearted. Perhaps it is difficult to write an article showing how close to failure the existing coal-dominated power grid can get.
      There was a hint in the article that the underlying problem is that the price and volume of power that can be sold from properly maintained thermal power stations cannot compete with new generation renewables. You wouldn’t want to talk about that too much.

  10. Warren Blair 2 years ago

    FACT . . . Australia has on or near the highest retail electricity prices (ex tax) in the

    Most on this forum will explain this away with a variety of lies, half-truths and distortions.

    And most on this forum are ideological non-industry left wingers.

    The ACCC has just handed a further sentence to average non-solar grid
    consumers who are the majority paying for the heavily subsidized renewables

    Remember Google blew a couple of hundred million trying to prove everyone was doing renewables wrong. Then abruptly in 2014 Google stopped and admitted renewables were unviable. Some of their engineers were not so polite using words to describe renewables that can’t be repeated here.

    Check out IEEE if you haven’t educated yourself on Google’s renewables realisation . . .

    • Giles 2 years ago

      Dream on. Google now sources its electricity 100% from renewables.
      the misadventure you mention was some really “smart” guys trying to dream up some technologies that don’t exist, before someone tapped them on the shoulder and said, maybe you should focus on wind and solar. So Google did. It’s really not that hard.

      • Warren Blair 2 years ago

        Giles the subject is not Google’s electricity source.
        The subject is – – do renewables (solar & wind) deliver?

        Please don’t be dishonest! Google spent most of its time and money under RE-C on solar & wind. They turned their attention to wacky alternatives when they found solar & wind were a dead end.

        Anyway ask James Hansen what’s going to happen to solar & wind. He was a principal adviser to RE-C.

        Commercial solar & wind will not exist by 2080.

        • neroden 2 years ago

          OK, that’s the most delusional thing I’ve read in months, Mr. Blair. Literally everything you wrote is insane nonsense.

          Lazard, the investment bank, disagrees with you. I suggest you read their analysis of what is going on *today*. Google is sourcing 100% of its energy from wind and solar, as are most other major corporations — because wind and solar deliver. Fossil fuels do not.

          • Warren 2 years ago

            “Google is sourcing 100% of its energy from wind and solar”.
            What has that to do with anything?
            Many corporations source 100% from renewables including Apple Inc.
            The fact is renewables are subsidised by others and as Google plainly states, “renewables are not viable”.

          • Roger Brown 2 years ago

            You will find dirty coal/Gas have been subsidised for many ,many years .

        • Ren Stimpy 2 years ago

          James Hansen is brilliant, and a legend of the diagnosis of the climate change threat to humanity.

          But that’s where he should stop and contain his opinion, because his own suggested treatment of the problem (nuclear) is not cost effective, and thus not effective.

          • Warren 2 years ago

            Ok you know better.

          • Ren Stimpy 2 years ago

            Yes anyone who knows cost (i.e. any consumer), knows better.

          • Warren 2 years ago

            No worries Ren, your a bit like your mate Rod below.
            He brought up Louisiana! Well we know a bit about that market. The Waterford Nuclear Generating Station in Louisiana is happily selling power to the West South Central USA wholesale market for USD 0.0185/kWh. We’re paying USD 0.0423/kWh in Oklahoma.

            The last few days is my first on a ‘renewables’ site. I came here to see how much misinformation is circulating in Australia where I’m based.

            Our development centre in Melbourne has developed two machines for manufacturing building products targeted at the Asian market in particular. They were to be installed in Melbourne; however, the cost of electricity has now made that impossible.

            So I’m currently interested in how the renewables push down-under has crucified a good deal of the future of Australian energy-intensive manufacturing.

            No problem though other industries will fill the gap, like drugs. Many non-academic socially challenged young boys who would have found a decent job in a factory can now sit around smoking and snorting to relieve the pain of being unemployed.
            I’d say most of the commenters on this site are left-leaning academic types into virtue signalling and feeling smug about their amazing progressiveness.

          • Ren Stimpy 2 years ago

            No worries Warren. You’re (note the spelling of you’re) a bit like many of the ego-only-driven fuckwits who try to take a shortcut into a finance career. You WILL go broke because you just don’t have the proper education nor the principles. The rest of our hard working society will probably have to compensate you and your (note the correct use of your) ego driven idiot short-cut seeking uneducated friends for your grossly uneducated decisions.

            Warren, please become a sparky or a plumber, or seek higher education in finance and economics, because right now you are just a dander to society.

          • Ren Stimpy 2 years ago

            OMG, RenewEconomy (god bless ’em) are substituting **** for *** in comments?

          • Rod 2 years ago

            Over at Mudrake any F bomb is auto deleted. I can’t even abuse the mods for their biased censorship.

          • Ren Stimpy 2 years ago

            There goes free speech.

          • Rod 2 years ago

            We should keep it civil but *** it is hard sometimes.

          • Ren Stimpy 2 years ago

            Fuck the fuckwits … testing 123.

          • Ren Stimpy 2 years ago

            I didn’t say “Hooray Henry” by f***, they did that, has this excellent site RenewEconomy been homogenised and womanised like all the rest? Way to cheat yourself out of income guys.

          • Giles 2 years ago

            No. But can’t you tell i don’t want that sort of swearing on the comments. it ain’t needed. Thanks for your understand and co-operation.

          • Ren Stimpy 2 years ago

            Accepted. I love your site. I love what you are doing. I will try not to be a swearing tossil from here onwards.

          • Ren Stimpy 2 years ago

            Who tf is Hooray Henry? I didn’t say that.

          • Daniel 2 years ago

            I love how you use google as a example of how renewable energy unviable, then when you find out they are 100% renewable you go to “What has that to do with anything”

            You are funny.

    • shane 2 years ago

      Australia is powered by coal as the dominant energy source.
      You may need to google privatisation of energy networks to get some answers.
      You may also need to look at the types of people installing solar rooftop and adopting new technologies etc,
      I would not classify them all as “left wing”

    • Rod 2 years ago

      FACT. The average cost of electricity in the US is about AU16.4c kWh.
      I dare say courtesy of lots of taxpayer built hydro and unclear energy.
      FACT The average residential user in the US uses about 10,000kWh per year.
      FACT The average residential user in Louisiana uses $14,881kWh per year.
      I make that $2,440 per year just on the energy portion of a bill in Louisiana.
      Double that for poles and wires and that is a $5000 per year energy bill.
      FACT That is much higher than your average Australian pays per year.

      • Warren 2 years ago

        Rod is a bald-faced LIAR . . .
        Average residential price in Louisiana is currently USD 0.0979/kWh.
        We have a factory in Oklahoma currently paying USD 0.0423/kWh.
        Louisiana is the cheapest in the West South Central USA.
        Rod you wouldn’t happen to be of direct German descent would you?

        • Rod 2 years ago

          The average cost per kWh over all States is 16.4c AU That is a fact. Use your table and work it out.

          I used Louisiana as the highest users. Let’s use the average use per US resident then. $1640 per year just for the energy.

          Who cares what your business pays

          This is your idiotic initial Statement

          ” Australia has on or near the highest retail electricity prices (ex tax) in the

        • Rod 2 years ago

          Here’s a job for you numpty.
          Find a list of average RESIDENTIAL electricity use in every US State and multiply it by your table. Don’t forget to convert to AU.
          Then calculate the average energy portion per RESIDENTIAL customer. Finding the poles and wires and retailer costs might be difficult so just double your energy figure.
          I can assure you the average RESIDENTIAL bill in Australia will be below some of the US States.
          Therefore making a LIAR of you and your ridiculous claims.

    • GlennM 2 years ago

      You gotta love guys like Warren…
      Apple, Google, Warren Buffett, Chinese Govt, Indian Govt, German Govt, 1.6 million Aussie house owners thousands of businesses all know that RE works and is cheaper than Coal…..

      But they are all wrong and “Warren” from ” I married my cousinville” in Louisiana thinks he is brighter and cleverer than all of them…


      • Warren 2 years ago

        I know what we pay in the USA, China and Australia ‘the renewables leader’.
        Makes no difference to me we just install where the power is reasonably priced. At the moment that isn’t Australia (used to be though).

    • Daniel 2 years ago

      Warren, you can sit an whinge and whine about renewables all you want, in the end the world is already transitioning away from fossil fuels quite rapidly. Most likely there will never be a new coal power station built in Australia. 70% of new power capacity being built world wide is now renewable, the fight is lost.

      Just lie back and watch it happen, that’s all you can do at this point. Might save you from popping a vein in your forehead.

  11. Shilo 2 years ago

    There are lots of problems with having heaps of everything to cover for the weather, and little things going wrong. The return for every one in the game.
    With RE there will eventually be lots of days when it will be a lottery as to who gets paid what. Thats for house holds and the proper projects.
    Trying to get it all to work and balanced coming from so many sources is going to be very complex.
    Then the government is going to want to make money out of it, and will want security of supply. House holds will actually have to pay people to come and maintain the solar and make it work.

    • solarguy 2 years ago

      Yes it will be complex, that’s why we need a gov with a plan to set this process in motion. I mentioned that in another post. As for your last sentence, there is very little maintenance needed, anyone who has a system only has to check output every day and clean panels every so often. No big deal.

      • Shilo 2 years ago

        Same can be said about a car and oil, or windows in a house!!!!!!!. Quite a few people don’t do anything.
        The odd solar cell will go down and the odd inverter, plus a range of other things.
        Once the Government need security of supply, you will find they will demand that a person inspects the set up every 3 months or more and it will be part of your requirment for having a connection to the grid.
        I would bet the left one!!!!

        • solarguy 2 years ago

          Your analogy in respect of roof top solar is joke. If the output goes down or non existent on any individual home system it won’t be a disaster for the grid and hasn’t been. The government won’t have any control of a private system that small, so that idea is BS.

          • Shilo 2 years ago

            Its the combined problems of people not getting things fixed or not cleaning the cells and not replacing the cells that go down or the inverter. Combined across a huge amount of installations the government will want to ensure things are in order.
            Maybe once every three month is too much, I am just guessing at that, but I am quite sure with the amount domestic roof top solar is going to add its going to be viewed as one of the links in the chain. They will force inspections and costs onto people.
            They may in fact even force people to actually have Solar.
            Things normally go like a clock, 12 is encouragement to install solar, and 6 is to make people have solar.
            Say like the Flu shot, starts out as this would be a good idea and we will give it to you and ends up, you have no choice and you have to pay for it.

          • solarguy 2 years ago

            What a load of crap. Clearly you have no idea what your on about. No energy grid would or is likely to rely on the indvidual or collective output from small private owned systems. That’s what Utility scale RE generation and storage is for.

          • Shilo 2 years ago

            Thats fair enough, we both have very strong views about that.
            It is not a matter of not knowing what your on about, its simply a opinion which can be correct or partly correct or wrong.

          • solarguy 2 years ago

            What is clear to me Shilo is that you don’t have much knowledge about these things. Can I suggest, that the best way to learn is to ask questions, rather than assume anything ok.

            People on this forum have a lot of knowledge and will more than likely answer some questions to help give you the big picture. However if we think you are coal troll we won’t waste our time.

            As far as I’m concerned the jury is still out, but at this time I’ll give you the benefit of the doubt.

          • Shilo 2 years ago

            Coal Troll? and I don’t have much knowledge about power generation I presume.
            I am just like anyone even world experts in any subject, casting a opinion.

  12. RobertO 2 years ago

    Hi Solarguy, after the batteries are all filled (PHES, Chemical and Mechanical, if we use that sort), then we have curtailed systems which will add H2 and man made CH4 to the natural gas system as the overflow. Some place will have Fuel Cells (filtered from natural gas pipes) either as backup emergency system or just backup system. Some will still have gas generation as part of the system. We will have a few more interconnects (HVDC mostly, my opinion is three interconnects from Tassie alone but higher capacity around 2040 – 2050 and 1000 MW systems and 800 kV). The interconnects are mainly for security of supply after local supply is fully used. One thing that may happen is an east west HVDC if the Pilbara inter country system gets going (they will drop in price and solar / wind will also drop in price).

    • solarguy 2 years ago

      But mate that is not a 100% renewable grid using any fossil fuels.That’s why I mentioned plenty of storage. Blakers, I think mentioned about 23GWh. He may be right, but he may be wrong.

  13. Robert Comerford 2 years ago

    FACT sonny, I am far from being left wing as many of the people who know me will attest. Doesn’t mean I don’t care for the life support system we all rely on and want the best for us and our descendants.
    That means ceasing polluting and bringing to an end the ponzie schemes that are endless growth. The price to do it is whatever it costs, just like winning a war.
    It costs money to transition, but the savings come big time at the end.
    If my grandparents didn’t invest in the electricity network I would still be getting much of my energy needs from tins of kerosene. Many of the big infrastructure projects started in the first half of the last century I was paying off with my tax contribution when I started work in the 60’s. However, the benefits to me were enormous.

    Lack of vision by successive governments, to not invest in the renewable resources that this country is blessed with so we eventually end up with cheaper electricity than any other large country in the world is infuriating.

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