Death spiral for cars. By 2030, you probably won’t own one | RenewEconomy

Death spiral for cars. By 2030, you probably won’t own one

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By 2030, you probably won’t own a car, but you may get a free trip with your morning coffee. Transport-As-A-Service will use electric vehicles and will upend two trillion-dollar industries. It’s the death spiral for cars.

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An employee checks newly-assembled electric cars at an electric vehicle factory in Zouping county, Shandong province, in this September 24, 2013 file photo. China's auto sales could be heading for a rare fall this year, but one bright spot is in so-called green cars, where sales have almost quadrupled so far in 2015. REUTERS/China Daily/Files CHINA OUT. NO COMMERCIAL OR EDITORIAL SALES IN CHINA
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By 2030, you probably won’t own a car, but you may get a free trip with your morning coffee. Transport-As-A-Service will use only electric vehicles and will upend two trillion-dollar industries. It’s the death spiral for cars.

A major new report predicts that by 2030, the overwhelming majority of consumers will no longer own a car – instead they will use on-demand electric autonomous vehicles.

By 2030, within 10 years of regulatory approval of autonomous electric vehicles (A-EVs), the report says, 95 per cent of all US passenger miles traveled will be served by on-demand, autonomous, electric vehicles that will be owned by fleets rather than individuals.

The provision of this service may come virtually free as part of another offering, or a corporate sponsorship. Imagine, for instance, paying a token sum for a ride into town after buying a latte for $4.50. Or getting a free ride because the local government has decided to make transport easier.

TAAS choice

The report, by RethinkX, an independent think tank that focuses on technology-driven disruption and its implications across society, says this stunning and radical will be driven entirely by economics, and will overcome the current desire for individual car ownership, starting first in the big cities and then spreading to the suburbs and regional areas.

This disruption will have enormous implications across the transportation and oil industries, decimating entire portions of their value chains, causing oil demand and prices to plummet, and destroying trillions of dollars in investor value, not to mention the value of used cars.

At the same time it will create trillions of dollars in new business opportunities, consumer surplus and GDP growth.

Lead consultant and co-author Tony Seba, who specialises in disruptive technologies. His early forecasts for the enormous uptake of solar where considered crazy, but were proved right, and he has since said that new technologies will make coal, oil and gas all but redundant by 2030).

He says while the report focuses on the US, the forecasts are valid for Australia too, because the transportation industry is global. And he warns that the car you buy now may well be your last.

“This is a global technology disruption. So yes, this applies to Australia,” Seba tells RenewEconomy. “And this is going to happen despite governments, not because of governments.

“Furthermore, the disruption will start in cities with high population density and high real estate prices – think Sydney and Melbourne then Perth, Brisbane and Adelaide – and quickly radiate out to the suburbs, the smaller cities, and then rural areas.”

Indeed, there are some people who are starting to anticipate this change, considering Australian-based business models and even local manufacturing, such as those revealed on Monday by Michael Molitor, the head of a new company called A2EmCo.

Seba does not say that individual car ownership will completely disappear. By 2030, 40 per cent of cars will still be privately owned, but they will only account for 5 per cent of kilometres traveled.

Autonomous cars will be used 10 times more than internal combustion vehicles were, they will last longer – maybe one million miles (1.6 million km) – and the savings will inject an additional $1US trillion into the pockets of Americans by 2030.

Seba admits that his forecasts are hard to digest. But what he sees in the transition to autonomous EVs from privately owned petrol cars is the same he has seen for all other major transitions: what he calls the 10x opportunity cost.

It happened with the printing press, it happened with the first Model T – it cost the same as a carriage and two horses, but offered 10x the horsepower.

“Every time we have had a ten x change in technology, we had a disruption. This is going to be no different.”

And that change, he says, will happen on day one of level 5 autonomous EVs obtaining regulatory approval. “Basically, the day that autonomous vehicles are regulatory accepted, transport-as-a-service will be 10 cheaper than cost of new vehicles,” he says. And four times cheaper than the cost of already owned vehicles.

Why is this? Because everything will be cheaper.

Like his predictions on the rise of solar, and the sudden decline of fossil fuels, Seba’s calculations are driven by simple economics. Within few years, the upfront costs of AEVs will match those of petrol cars. But the depreciation costs will be minimal, because the cars, owned by fleets, will “last a lifetime”.

Maintenance costs will be significantly lower – thanks to 20 moving parts in the powertrain compared to 2,000 for petrol cars – and the miles travelled significantly higher; they will be doing 1.6 million km by 2030, more than five times more than petrol cars.

TAAS economics

Moreover, battery technology will improve, needing to be replaced only once, and old batteries will be able to used elsewhere (in the power grid). The cost of maintenance will be one-fifth the cost of current cars, the cost of finance one tenth, and the cost of insurance also one tenth.

“The survival of car manufacturers will depend on building cars with long lifetimes and low operating costs. This means that they will optimise for minimum waste of resources in building and operating vehicles, including designing vehicle platforms with parts that are interchangeable and recyclable.”

The report outlines the huge benefits from this transformation. Unclogging city roads, removing the pollution that is choking major cities, savings millions of lives from accidents and trillions of dollars in health impacts, and freeing up parking space.

We often forget about the health impacts of fuel cars. In 2015 in the OECD alone, outdoor air pollution lead to $US1.7 trillion annual economic cost from premature deaths. According to the World Health Organisation, 1.25 million people died from road traffic accidents around the world in that year, and another 50 million were severely injured.

“Autonomous vehicles will be safer than human drivers, leading to a decrease in road traffic accidents,” the report says. Although, to be sure, any such accidents caused by faulty software rather than humans will create huge controversy

The nature of the vehicles may also change – with a range of two-person, four-person, eight-person and even bigger vehicles in heavy population areas.

It will also have an impact on geopolitics – with the world no longer dependent on oil reserves for the bulk of its transportation needs. This will benefit big transport fuel importers like Australia.

The “politics of lithium,” meanwhile, are completely different to the politics of oil. Lithium is plentiful, although it needs planning to ensure that the mines are in place to extract it, and its demand can be reduced by recycling. Alternatives can be found for cobalt, currently found mostly in countries such as Democratic republic of Congo.

TAAS salesSeba recognises that most people assume that the biggest impediments to this scenario are behavioral issues such as love of driving, fear of new technology, or just habit. The cost savings, the speed, the increased safety and the extra free time will be key factors.

But he says that what he calls “pre-TaaS” companies such as Uber, Lyft and Didi have also invested billions of dollars developing technologies and services to overcome these issues. In 2016, these companies drove 500,000 passengers per day in New York City alone.

“That was triple the number of passengers driven the previous year. The combination of TaaS’s dramatically lower costs compared with car ownership and exposure to successful peer experience will drive more widespread usage of the service.

“Adopting TaaS requires no investment or lock-in. Consumers can try it with ease and increase usage as their comfort level increases. Even in suburban and rural areas, where wait times and cost might be slightly higher, adoption is likely to be more extensive than generally forecast because of the greater impact of cost savings on lower incomes.

“As with any technology disruption, adoption will grow along an exponential S-curve.”

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2,195 Comments
  1. Chris Drongers 3 years ago

    I am buying shares in electric power companies (initially in power station installers, later in power-sharing-sales)!
    I’ll start believing in this when (robotically connecting) charging points appear outside my 7-11 and in numbers in my shopping centre carparks.

    • Greg Hudson 3 years ago

      Tesla has already created a robo charger. Watch the video. Amazing !
      http://www.motoring.com.au/tesla-creates-robo-snake-charger-53048

    • Mike Dill 3 years ago

      Power companies are going to be fighting the lower cost of solar and storage. Not a big winning play there.

    • Peter Campbell 3 years ago

      I have been charging one electric car at home for 8 years and two for over 3 years with just an ordinary power point in the carport. It is really no big deal. I rarely find public charging points to be useful or necessary for urban travel. What would be useful is fast chargers along highways and at the urban fringes to extend the range lower range EVs.

  2. Adam Smith 3 years ago

    Totally agree that the combustion engine is almost redundant, but will really look forward to getting my boat towed to the ramp for the cost of a latte! The grey nomads will also no doubt look forward to not owning a car. Some of this must have been thought up whilst sipping a latte and munching on a smashed advocado whatever. Sure it will be cheap, but cars have always been a personal thing and I would suggest the rich will still be buying the latest EV Porsche, Mercedes or BMW and the kids will be hotting up a 10 year old petrol WRX, with aftermarket 4 wheel electric drive and a tesla pack. The socialist utopia ideal never worked anywhere and the auto industry has always been anything but a communal pursuit.

    • MikeH 3 years ago

      Millennials & Gen-Xers are already reducing their car usage in the USA and there is no socialism in sight. Uber & Lyfft are models of aggressive capitalism being developed to provide a more convenient service cheaper than the alternative and they are having a big impact with the transport habits of the young.

      http://time.com/money/4185441/millennials-drivers-licenses-gen-x/

      Today’s cities where the bulk of people live are quite different to when the baby boomers established the car culture – cars now just as likely to mean traffic jams. The city centres are starting to ban cars or limit access. Driving holidays are being replaced by cheap air travel.

      Whatever happens, autonomous vehicles are going to be very disruptive.

      • Durham 52 3 years ago

        Baby boomers hardly “established the car culture”, as a baby boomer I was born in 1952 and wasn’t old enough to drive until 1968, the “car culture” was well and truly established by then believe me.

        • MikeH 3 years ago

          I am sure it was since 1952 was not the start of the baby boomer generation.

          “Baby boomers are the demographic group born during the post–World War II baby boom, approximately between the years 1946 and 1964.”

          While the USA had roads and suburbs prior to the war, the US Interstate Highway system which drove the popularity of the driving holiday was built post 1956. The postwar expansion of the city into suburbs beyond the reach of existing public transport networks drove the increased use of cars in the city.

          • Durham 52 3 years ago

            Yes, I’m aware that the baby boomer period started in 1946, even so the first baby boomers to reach legal driving age would have begun driving in the mid 60’s at the earliest. In fact the years designated as the baby boomer years means that boomers began driving between 1967 (assuming a driving age of 17 years) and 1981. My only point was that the culture of the car was firmly established well before the majority of baby boomers were legally behind the wheel.

          • UncleFedele 3 years ago

            The “car culture” stretches back to at least the 1920s and, were I interested in researching a precise date, I could probably make the case that it was pre-1920.

            The other problem with your assertion that boomers established the car culture is that it existed pre-WWII in France, Germany, Italy, and the UK and probably other European countries. Appreciation of the freedom conveyed by individually owned automobiles and motorcycles is appreciated across all cultures advanced and prosperous enough to own them.

            The interstate highway system, which was built to facilitate moving military assets efficiently across country, did make driving holidays to more distant destinations easier, but driving holidays to closer locations were already popular as were day trips for family get aways, picnics, etc.

            The reality of automotive adoption in this and other countries is rather different that you portray.

      • MaxG 3 years ago

        Forget this article: they asked 618 people; really?! Is this considered representative for a country where over 250m cars and light trucks are on the road, with an increase of 5m between 2014 and 2015. Someone must drive these 5m vehicles 🙂

      • Grand2833 3 years ago

        There is no cheap or pleasant air travel. Their is no reduction in car usage. Anyone who can afford a car is driving a car. In our multi-racial society a car provides a physical barrier that offers protection from violent and criminal elements of our society. In an emergency situation such as wildfires, hurricanes, flooding it is gas-powered vehicles that allow the evacuation of cities and threatened areas. It is power lines and cell towers that are the first to fall in a hurricane or a badly flooded area. How do you propose to charge the batteries in thousands of vehicles fleeing a natural catastrophe? I live in New Orleans, Louisiana. The entire city was evacuated before Hurricane Katrina. People left on the trains, the buses, but most left the city in their own vehicles. Tens of thousands of people all trying to get out of the city. It took hours just to reach the city limits. Electric vehicles would have lost half their charge just getting out of the city of New Orleans. No one will risk their lives, certainly not the lives of their children, to have an electric vehicle. It’s not worth it, when it all comes down everybody is responsible for their own safety. You cannot depend on government to take care of you and your family. No one will give up their gas-powered vehicles.

        • brother_eu 3 years ago

          Snowflakes don’t understand that. Like moths flying right into a zapper.

        • Calamity_Jean 3 years ago

          “Electric vehicles would have lost half their charge just getting out of the city of New Orleans.”

          No they wouldn’t. An electric vehicle standing still with its heater or air conditioner off uses a negligible amount of power. It’s not like an oil-burning car that uses fuel while idling in traffic.

          Please remember that in the 2018 model year there will be at least three battery-powered cars that will have ranges on a full charge of about 200 miles. If they left New Orleans fully charged, wouldn’t they be safe when they ran out of charge 200 miles away?

      • Chad Burke 3 years ago

        Ever heard of a taxi? Uber and Lyft aren’t exactly radically new concepts. More of a step sideways.

    • Chris Drongers 3 years ago

      Some petrol cars will remain, like horses. A statement of high income.
      But if autonomous cars become common it won’t be long until manually driven cars are banned from major transport routes, school zones, entertainment areas.

      • Grand2833 3 years ago

        Keep dreaming….

    • Chris Ford 3 years ago

      The article does say that by 2030, “40 per cent of cars will still be privately owned, but they will only account for 5 per cent of kilometres traveled.” So those who want/need their own vehicle for specialised purpose are still catered for in the prediction.

      • Durham 52 3 years ago

        Yes, just living in a rural area means needing a vehicle. I can’t see rural towns and remote properties being serviced by autonomous vehicles, most places beyond the urban fringe can barely get a bus or train! The usual “not enough people to make the service economic” argument will no doubt apply. Still if they reduce congestion in the cities, it will be nice for us country folk when we have to drive our cars to the city.

        Bring on the electric 4×4 with a 500+ klm range.

        • Chris Ford 3 years ago

          … and a solar roof so it’ll charge itself. 🙂

          • Grand2833 3 years ago

            What a ridiculous notion! Do you have solar cells on your roof? No, you do not or you would realize they provide very little electricity. These vehicles would have their down time during the night. No current is generated from solar cells during the night. Windmills? Not if the wind isn’t blowing, no current there. Oh, golly gee, we would have to have coal burninig electrical generation, perhaps natural gas to generate all that electricity needed for millions of electric vehicles. Better start building those power plants because you will need to triple the amount of electricity generated today in order to charge up all those electric cars. Darn, those details are always so pesky and expensive. That reminds me, who gets to pay the bill for this socialist pipe dream? Who’s going to pay the extra taxes for all this nonsense?

          • Calamity_Jean 3 years ago

            Dream on, guy. The wave of the future is renewable and electric.

        • Miles Harding 3 years ago

          Tesla Model X 100D?
          Sorry about the affordability, though.

          • ben 3 years ago

            yes they are and will be expensive, but the thing is we won’t need to buy one, we will pay on a per usage basis. So the actual cost of the vehicle is secondary. How much does a plane cost? No-one owns their own, they buy a ticket

        • BushAxe 3 years ago

          There’s a good argument that autonomous EV’s will be able to provide cheap public transport to alot of people that are unable to drive including rural areas currently deemed unviable.

      • Grand2833 3 years ago

        The “prediction” is nonsense. The left has a tendency to believe if they repeat their nonsense enough times people will begin to believe it and accept it as fact. Fortunately, the majority of the people do not fall for this tactic. Common sense prevails and people simply dismiss stories like this as more of the liberal nonsense put out by the media.

        • Calamity_Jean 3 years ago

          Wait five years, you’ll be surprised. Wait ten years and you’ll hardly find an oil-burning car.

      • Calamity_Jean 3 years ago

        I imagine that families with children small enough to need safety seats will have their own cars, just because installing, removing, and lugging around the seats would be such a hassle. When the youngest child got big enough to use a standard adult seat belt, the parents might give up having their own car with a sigh of relief.

        • Chris Ford 3 years ago

          Yep, agree. Plus, shifting 350kg of baby/kid stuff from autonomous taxi to autonomous taxi would get annoying pretty quickly. 🙂

    • JoeR_AUS 3 years ago

      Agree,I not sure it will be redundant, after towing a boat for 120km and driving 1700km in a week last year!

      I still think hybrid is the way to go as people talk about “30km a day” but there are too many days were the rule is broken. So we will have ICE and BEV together, I know some people say BEV only but they should ride a bicycle ie they are single person back and to work only.

      Also the above report does not cover the social impact on jobs, if all couriers, uber, taxis, hire cars are replaced what will all these people do for a job?

      Eventually, the dialogue of manufacturing in the country vs importation must come up as how much pollution is generated in the Global economy by shipping/ flying all over the world – much more than ICE for personal use!

      • nakedChimp 3 years ago

        Fine, BEVs don’t cover your usage pattern yet.
        Mine isn’t covered yet either.
        But I don’t post that PHEV will be the way to go. It’s too complicated and expensive and will be obvious in 5 years.

        As for the socio-economic impact of people being set free from jobs that will be done by robots/AI while still needing an income for a dignified life – well – UBI comes to mind. Financing it will be the greatest social battle the world has ever seen.

        • JoeR_AUS 3 years ago

          PHEV and BEv will be the only option from EU as 95gm C02 per Km is mandated as fleet average for 2020.

          Yes it will be more expensive.

          Dignified life – sounds like depression to me!

  3. trackdaze 3 years ago

    I’m not sure how this will solve congestion issues given that there will be some inefficiencies with a uberlift having to travel between gigs. Parking may be easier.

    • Rod 3 years ago

      You would hope there would be some sort of car pooling, ride sharing ability.
      Good point re the parking. Should free up some road space.

      • ben 3 years ago

        I believe that some 20% of the area of the Adelaide CBD (where I live) is taken up by car-parks, either flat bed or high rise. If these are no longer required for cars, or have a massive reduction in usage, then they could be repurposed for cycle parks.

        • Rod 3 years ago

          Yay, e-bikes allowed I hope.
          Adelaide City Council would go broke!

          • ben 3 years ago

            Well exactly. So that means there is a vested interest in ensuring there is large scale commuting via owner-vehicles.

          • Rod 3 years ago

            Yes, unfortunately.
            I think the ACC, along with the State Libs, had a hand in squashing the ALP proposal of a dollar a day car parking tax in the CBD

          • ben 3 years ago

            That wouldn’t surprise me. The ACC own “U Park”, and I am sure make a tidy sum from it. At the same time they are the development approval regulatory authority for new car parks. Conflict of interest?

      • trackdaze 3 years ago

        There is the potential it leads to more cars. With one required for your service near your home near your work..etc etc …..

        • Mike Shackleton 3 years ago

          With this statement you are demonstrating a lack of understanding about how the system would work.

          • trackdaze 3 years ago

            To wonder is to begin to understand Mike.

            did say potential afterall. Say for instance people abandon mass public transit in favour of a more personal service in the morning…at peak start times…..

          • Grand2833 3 years ago

            No, actually he is making a good point. The system you envision is simply not feasible without a massive government infrastructure, at enormous costs, in total control of all traffic. Unworkable and unaffordable.

    • Mike Shackleton 3 years ago

      You won’t be the only one using the car yeah? And you’ll book in your trip details – origin, destination, when you want to arrive in advance. With perfect implementation the car that arrives at the kerb to pick you up will have only completed a trip moments before, and will go onto another trip once it drops you off. In order to bring your trip cost down you will also have the option of sharing the car with someone else, which the booking system will manage so as to minimise disruption to your trip.

      Live traffic planning using apps such as Google Maps has already made traffic flow more efficient in cities.

      • JoeR_AUS 3 years ago

        Try this for 100,000 people going to the ANZ stadium during peak hour on a wet night – and then 3 hours later to pick them all up again.

        Sure it can be done but the current generation will google a car 5 mins before they need it on there smart phone. So some central body will need to plan the cars and have them ready for the load, so it sounds like a public system and all the good things that brings!

        • Mike Shackleton 3 years ago

          That’s a stupid example I think you’re being deliberately obtuse – that stadium is well serviced by trains why would you order up a car when you can get reasonably close to your destination using the train and then catch a share car from the station if need be?

          • JoeR_AUS 3 years ago

            I only used a real example:

            As obviously you have never sat in the traffic jam that starts from Homebush and queues past Macquarie Park on Lane Cove RD and also backs up on Blaxland Rd to Eastwood.

    • Miles Harding 3 years ago

      Another way to free up road space is to close up following distances, which could be much shorter for ‘platoons’ of 8 or 10 vehicles. Another advantage is that wind drag (for most) is greatly reduced.

      There is a lot or research being conducted at present to establish the rules and behaviour so platoons interact safely and sensibly with other road users.

      One limitation is that it is a once-off improvement and will not solve congestion if traffic density increases greatly (could double?) becuase of this empty travel between gigs. Multi-passenger travel would help, perhaps Ubers should be mini-buses and not passenger cars.

      An Uber behaving badly could also use the roads as a parking lot by causing a gridlock.

  4. john 3 years ago

    I have a relation who has never owned a vehicle.
    He does own a push bike, if that can be determined as a vehicle.
    I expect if he ever purchases a vehicle it will be an EV.
    However the article does relate to his situation to some extent although his use of public transport is his primary travel choice.
    I would venture to say his savings from never having purchased the worst consumer item ever produced is handsomely reflected in his financial situation.

    • Rod 3 years ago

      For most of my working life I commuted by bike allowing us to have only one car (for the wife to get to work)
      No doubt about it, cars are money pits. People obsess over fuel prices but are oblivious to the standing costs.

    • JoeR_AUS 3 years ago

      Yes transportation cost money but so does living, you do what you can afford

  5. Ian 3 years ago

    Electric Vehicle does not equal autonomous vehicle. Two different concepts, but these technologies will obviously coincide in the same vehicle. I for one would be happy to have an EV without autonomy parked in my suburban drive but would equally be happy ( but scared sh-tless no doubt) to use an autonomous ICE vehicle in the city.

    • trackdaze 3 years ago

      If your like me Ian then you would welcome every other driver on the road have autonomous driving?

      • Ian 3 years ago

        I would much prefer if other road users chose times to travel different to my own!

      • yarpos . 3 years ago

        A friend of mine is eagerly awaiting autonmous vehicles. He wants to brake check them and watch the hipsters spill their turmeric lattes. He is evil though.

        • trackdaze 3 years ago

          I can imagine any artifical intelligence driving assistence may see just how bad driving standards are pull over to side off the road and have a big artificial cry…”its all too hard” will flash up on the screen.

          Ps:Just let him know that emergency braking tech is currently only 70% effective in avoiding a crash.

          So he has about 1 in 3 chance of smelling like tumeric. Not good.

    • Jan Veselý 3 years ago

      It§s the economy. When you an auto drives really a lot of km, the purchase costs are becoming secondary, the operation cost starts to rule. EVs are much cheaper to operate.

      • JoeR_AUS 3 years ago

        Hmm I don’t know anybody (unless retired and cash upped) who buy a vehicle from cash.

        So the lease/loan is the most expensive part not the ruining costs and once they get to a certain age you upgrade as its cheaper to buy new then run a old car (unless low miles). The argument that you will not need to upgrade…. who wants a 10year BEV when you can have a better new one!

        A BEV needs to be cheaper than ICE from the start then it will come down to your personal usage, distance, etc

        • Jan Veselý 3 years ago

          I think you didn’t get it. The trick is in transport-as-a-service model. In that case, car will be owned by some service providing company, customers will pay for the ride. What is certain, that with this business model, cars will be 10-15x more utilized (200k km per year, not per lifetime). So, the cost of purchase will not be so important, service provider will gladly purchase twice as expensive product while it has 4x lower fuel costs and cheap maintanence.
          Why we are so sure? Just look at air traffic, railways, shipping or trucks, service vehicles.

          • JoeR_AUS 3 years ago

            Not true

            If the general public cold afford planes, helicopters, ships, trucks etc we would all have are own as the Wealthy already do!

  6. Steven Zilm 3 years ago

    Someone had better tell the guys that just paid $500k for a 1970 GT Falcon and the $1M for the Channel 7 A9X Torana they made big mistakes! Giles, I don’t think I’ll start selling my classic car collection just yet!…. But the Electric Hatchback Torana project is underway….

    • JoeR_AUS 3 years ago

      post pictures soon!

      Wait till Holden shut down in October this year, then we will see how much more they are worth as Australia will never produce a car again!

  7. Ian 3 years ago

    Time for someone to design in a quick-fit child seat system too. That is the single most inhibiting item for young families using taxis or other TaaS facility other than a bus.

  8. Michael Dufty 3 years ago

    I think if you look at the cars people currently buy, you can see that assuming people will go for something because it is the cheapest option is a long way from actual human behaviour.

    • whatsup 3 years ago

      The article address that point well. It’s not that people will always go for the cheapest option. It’s that there’s a well established tipping point where if the cost drops significantly while offering greater benefits, many or even most people will go for the lower cost option

      • HAGGIS1969 3 years ago

        BS

        • whatsup 3 years ago

          lol. Telling it like it is 🙂

          Care to share examples of mass-market products where the majority of people spend more than 10 times as much on products or services that offer less benefits?

      • Mina 3 years ago

        Not if it comes to giving up freedom of movement that is reliable and practical. Not a stupid idiot’s wet dream of a metrosexual’s unicorn.

  9. Douglas Hynd 3 years ago

    Where substantial investment is involved change is more gradual – decisions are not just economic they are driven by social, psychological factors and facilitating governance structures.

  10. ben 3 years ago

    I think cycling and walking will experience massive upside due to this – all of those roads will be able to be repurposed to use them for cycle ways, and they will be safe, because the autonomous cars will be able to detect the cyclists or pedestrians and not collide with them. This will lead to more people cycling and walking (as we know that cycling / walking infrastructure results in increases in both activities) which in turn will lead to health and wellbeing improvements. I wonder if anyone has modelled that?

    • Miles Harding 3 years ago

      Good point.
      A large number of our dopey drivers don’t stay within the carriage way and drive along with half of their car in the cycle lane. Is this just a WA thing?

      • ben 3 years ago

        Nope it’s an SA thing too

        • nakedChimp 3 years ago

          It’s an ‘I have not experienced how it is to be a cyclist’ thing.

          At least we now have the 1.5m distance thing when passing a cyclist in QLD – dunno about you guys.
          Before that became law – cyclists were startled and turned to look back at me what was up, when I slowed down to their speed, if there was not enough space to pass them safely on 2 lane roads.
          Talk about expectations.

          And yeah, if you ever rode a cycle and someone did pass you with more than 80 km/h in a distance of 1 meter you’d do the same.

          • ben 3 years ago

            Yes we have it too. It has made quite an impact although there are many drivers who ignore it.

          • Miles Harding 3 years ago

            So far, WA has failed on the 1.5 metre rule, perhaps because it was the Greens that proposed it and the Libs were in at the time. Compliance is the other issue. It’s been illegal to drive outside the carriageway for a very long time.

            Another aspect pf the EV experience it that it is easy to slow up and pace cyclists at a reasonable following distance as they negotiate traffic circles.

          • ben 3 years ago

            Yes but for autonomous EV they will need to tune the systems first. LIDAR are getting smaller all the time, and the ML systems to recognise bikes will improve greatly. The rise of e-bikes will help too as onboard GPS would help the system recognise their location

            http://spectrum.ieee.org/transportation/self-driving/selfdriving-cars-have-a-bicycle-problem

          • Miles Harding 3 years ago

            Enter the ‘bicycle algorithm’ …

          • ben 3 years ago

            They’ll work it out I am sure

          • Joe 3 years ago

            In Sydney we’ve got the 1.0 and 1.5 metre rule and as I cyclist on the road everyday I can tell you most drivers haven’t got a clue. Time to banish cars from the roads !

          • James Nilsson 3 years ago

            And that refrigerator you ordered van be delivered by bicycle.

        • Coley 3 years ago

          And a UK thing-:)

          • Joe 3 years ago

            And a Sydney thing

        • Donn N. 3 years ago

          And a PD thing.

    • JoeR_AUS 3 years ago

      haha, I ride a bike to work but I took a 18 year break while I dropped of my daughter/son to the school by car, later on to the buss stop. Everybody there drove as well, the only person who was close enough to walk the two kids lived less than 500m from the School . Most mums often have one in a pram – lots to carry on a bicycle.

      I can see bicycles not being the factor you think it will be, childless Alpha males maybe!

      However, ride on!

      • ben 3 years ago

        Yes I realise there are some impediments but a lot of what you describe can be overcome through protected cycle-paths and improvements to infrastructure.

        • JoeR_AUS 3 years ago

          great idea, but 50% of adults are obese, they are not going to put a leg over a top tube ever.

          Electric bicycle or motor bike has a chance but they got to be much cheaper but they will only raise accidents as once non enthusiast start to drive them, its all over!

          • ben 3 years ago

            Look I realise bikes are not suitable for everybody, but there are large health, economic and environmental benefits.

          • Grand2833 3 years ago

            Rain? Hot weather? Storms? Clothing from the drycleaners, groceries from the Wal-Mart eight miles away, dogs taken to the vet, three kids that need to go everywhere, family vacations, frequent trips to state parks, purchases from the local Home Depot or Lowe’s? Are you beginning to get my point here? It simply will not work. Bicycles and electric vehicles are a ridiculous waste of time. Cars are the cheapest and most reliable form of transportation in our society. That will never change because people will not accept anything that curtails their freedom of movement, that impacts their safety and the safety of their families. Wake up! This is the real world and real people don’t want the bicycles and the electric vehicles. Period.

          • ben 3 years ago

            Cycling is not suitable for every purpose, there are a mix of use-cases for which cycling is good and others where other modes of transport are good. You also have to look at the interplay between suburban living and transport modes. On EVs, they are cars. When autonomous EVs emerge you will be able to have one come and pick you up and take you to Wal-Mart, and the overall ownership cost will be much less.

        • rhcrest 3 years ago

          Yes a mother can carry her children and her groceries on a bike . No problem! You people are nuts

          • ben 3 years ago

            Not for 20 km along a freeway in the suburbs of course, but *in certain areas* it is reasonably common to see the Dutch style cargo bike carrying kids and groceries. A friend of mine has one and uses it every day.

          • rhcrest 3 years ago

            If that’s your choice then fine but most people are not going to do that

          • ben 3 years ago

            That is true. Even if you look at the Netherlands, cycling is about a third of the most frequent mode of transport, cars about 50% and public transport and walking the remainder. Where I live it is about 5%. So even if we double or triple that, we still have a long long way to go. The Netherlands were a predominately car dominated culture until they implemented a very strong policy of moving to cycling over several decades. It can be done.

    • James Nilsson 3 years ago

      Have you ever tried to cycle in snow at 20 below?

      • ben 3 years ago

        Nope, but I’ve cycled at 40 degrees Celsius. As I have said elsewhere, there is a mix of use-cases for differing modes of transport and not all of them are matched with each other. I realise this is a little difficult for people to understand.

  11. Cooma Doug 3 years ago

    The cars will coordinate tasks autonomously.
    We will have a travel plan and it will be accessable by all cars. We will also have an energy profile and cars will be the poles and wires to the high density and normal housing. They will park at residences and share energy for all purposes.
    There will be no need to pay or notify. It will be auto. The need to request a vehicle outside the plan will be a quick word into the phone.

    • ben 3 years ago

      Exactly. EVs are batteries on wheels. They will have multiple functions, transport as well as mobile energy.

      I’d also like to see the impact of EVs on public transport and commuting. A fleet of EVs could go and collect people from an area / suburb and take them into their workplaces – if the passengers put in their destination to the smart phone app and the system would optimise the route for pickup and delivery, plus collecting any other passengers along the way.

      The really important thing here is the interplay between smart houses, micro grids, energy trading, domestic solar / batteries and EVs.

      As you say, you can imagine a scenario whereby a facility or house will require additional power. A fully charged EV could automatically drive to the location and provide power to that facility, or conversely if a household had excess power from its solar array, the EV could charge itself from that solar array over the grid. A little like what Reposit Power are doing now.

      • Cooma Doug 3 years ago

        The residential high density blocks will have ample energy 24/7. Each resident on average will have 1 car.
        Each car will have details and energy sharing arrangements with all units.
        The possibilities are endless.

        When out the cars will frequently be connected to the grid via the charging stations. This will enable functions of energy management kn the main grid. There will always be many times more battery storage connected to the grid in this way than is tequired.

        I believe the contribution of the cars in this way would greatly reduce the cost of the energy use at home.

        • Mina 3 years ago

          Oh, GOD!

    • Grand2833 3 years ago

      Idiot. What nonsense, do you really think all the people of any large city will cooperate in this ? If you think this is possible I suggest you visit a city with it’s many different minority populations. The level of violence and the amount of property crime is overwhelming. No way these people are sharing anything, they are takers, consumers. Who is to pay for all these “shared” services? The vehicles, the maintenance and upkeep, the insurance, the energy costs? No, this is a ridiculous socialist dream of some fictional nirvana. It’s not happening in the real world with real people.

    • KevTuck 3 years ago

      There will still be phones?

    • Mina 3 years ago

      Your are sh-_’n us, aren’t you?

  12. Radbug 3 years ago

    Don’t forget EV Vespas. Unlike the ICE Vespas (etc), they have a huge advantage, they won’t damage your hearing.

    • Vox Veritas 3 years ago

      Huh? Speak up, please.

  13. Miles Harding 3 years ago

    I recall that the original nuclear power argument that it would be “too cheap to meter” didn’t work out exactly as predicted.

    I feel the same will be the case here. Anybody who drives an EV on a daily basis will be familiar with how much energy it actually uses. While it is true that maintenence will be reduced, it won’t be zero and there is still cost of finance and depreciation in additon to licensing and corporate profts for the ubers that will be presumably running the fleet.

    Most state and city administrations seem to be suffering financial stress, and are having diffculty collecting rubbish** these days, so offering a free car transport service in the near future seems unlikely.

    It would probably be reasonable to predict that taxis will be displaced and public transport augmented as passengers conclude that it is still quicker to take a short ride to the station and blast down the rails instead of sit in in a traffic jam with 50,000 other ubers.

    **Packaging laws with teeth could reduce this cost dramatically, except that the dopes in local government have all signed off-take agreements with garbage-to-power operators and are now trapped in cycles of excess waste to feed boilers.

  14. newnodm 3 years ago

    maybe by 2050.

  15. David K Clarke 3 years ago

    I’m dubious about the prediction that the EVs will do 1.6m km. We finally gave away our 330,000km, 20 year old Toyota Corona because of worn-out upholstery, door-seals, failed heater, drafts, rattles; the power system was still in good working condition.

    • Mike Shackleton 3 years ago

      You design these pooled EV cars with easily replaceable components – seats that are easy to reupholster or replace – door seals are not hard to replace and a heater box that is modular in nature. They might not be stylish but they will be incredibly utilitarian. Much like the London Taxi design I would expect.

      • JoeR_AUS 3 years ago

        sounds like a Trabant

        • nakedChimp 3 years ago

          Na, the Trabants frame was rusted through after 10 years in certain places.
          Not even Unterbodenschutz helped.
          Have been driven around in them for my first 18 years 😉
          Though I think the first we had I was already 2 or so.
          And had to be replaced when I turned 7 or thereabouts.

          You should imagine an enthusiast computer case which costs around $200 or more and will last you a lot of boards/cpus/graphic cards and hdd’s/ssd’s for a more fitting comparison.

  16. JoeR_AUS 3 years ago

    2030 this must mean that BEV cars are cheaper than ICE cars, to purchase otherwise n/a.

    Autonomous vehicles will have there place:

    My Parents are both to old, poor eye sight etc to drive they could benefit from it. Uber and Taxis too.

    The biggest hurdle for ownership is we predominately all access our vehicles at the same time, peak hour, school holidays, events. So this implies we have a fleet large enough to cover these periods but the vehicles will sit idle while we are at work, school, uni etc – bit like solar farms at night, wind farms on windless days….

    Furthermore, when we go on holidays we want a vehicles large enough to tow and carry the luggage, equipment and toys to the destination, so the BEV we need then are not the same BEV we need when you are single coming home from a party.

    Furthermore, whats the business plan for government to abandon fuel excise? They allowed 43% foreign investment into the VIC real estate market last year and the solution is a $5k fee on purchase – they really have no idea….

  17. REPENTorBURN 3 years ago

    The real danger to America was not just a filthy muslim sodomite by the name of Obama alone, but a citizenry capable of entrusting a filthy sodomite like him with the Presidency. It will be far easier to limit and undo the follies of a gay Obama presidency than to restore the necessary,commonsense ,Godliness and good judgment to a depraved electorate willing to have such a creature for their president or any democrat…

    The problem is much deeper and far more serious than Mr.gay muslim Obama, who is a mere symptom of what ails America . Blaming the prince of the gay fools should not blind anyone to the vast confederacy of fools that made him their prince. “The Republic can survive a gay Obama, who is, after all, merely a gay fool. It is less likely to survive a multitude of fools such as those who made this gay muslim creature their President.

  18. TroyGale 3 years ago

    Just another shallow thinking author who apparently doesn’t understand that America, and may other places in the world are never to be serviced by subways, planes, etc. Hey knock yourselves out with this story because it is a bunch of hooey! Just more closed minded reasoning from people who lack worldly experience and knowledge.

  19. MidAmerica2 3 years ago

    When it’s 20 below zero and snowing hard but I need to get to work or the doctor I don’t want to wait for some electric toy to show up….. if it even can.

    • Bobbie Irish 3 years ago

      Yeah! How about -40 below? Do they even work in those temperatures? Think not. Sure as heck don’t want to be stranded in some blizzard!

      • nickoury 3 years ago

        Is that F, C or both?

        • Dave 3 years ago

          Both, of course

          • nickoury 3 years ago

            Aw, you gave it away!

      • scott young 3 years ago

        But, with global warming there will be no more blizzards o -40 days…..lol

    • Jimbeau 3 years ago

      Electric-only vehicles CANNOT put out heat with any efficiency… the batteries die quickly. How many stories about Musk’s toys successfully being used in cold climes have you read?… It’s bull.

      • jtom 3 years ago

        Oh, but they’ll have solar panels on the roof of the vehicle! Just gotta keep brushing the snow off of them…and wait until dawn…and pray for sun.

        • Duocore2 3 years ago

          Hook up a pin wheel and blow real hard.

        • squirefld 3 years ago

          Solar panels can’t have any dust, dirt or bird poop on them either. You have to clean them off or lose power production.

        • Calamity_Jean 3 years ago

          Put wipers, like windshield wipers, on the roof. Clean the roof once and use the wipers to stay clean.

      • Willis Gray 3 years ago

        You can have my Tundra when you pry it from my cold dead fingers

    • fcabanski 3 years ago

      Yes, but you could get an electric toy in which some moron took a poop.

  20. Chance Boudreaux 3 years ago

    Horse crap. Individualists will still own cars. Especially if the “Elite” continue to flood America with foreigners that reduce social trust for mass transit. Catch a bus in Detroit and get back to me.

    • Grand2833 3 years ago

      Thank you, excellent point.

    • TAG 3 years ago

      Or dare to ride MARTA in the ATL

      • happy1ga 3 years ago

        I’d rather have bareback copulation with Lena Dunham.

      • Mina 3 years ago

        I had two old vehicles up until I had to sell the sedan. It was untrustworthy to start. Now the truck is regularly stalling. I cannot even drive it on back streets for that reason. Must sell and save for a newer one that is reliable. Meanwhile I have become well familiar with MARTA, train and busses. I’m down to walking and sometimes pulling a 4 wheel wagon with the cooler and bungee cords. (Name isn’t Mina, btw.) Taking public transportation sucks. Hardly a restroom in sight. Long waits at street stops without seating. And I’m getting well up there in age. Feel like a regular bum wearing my sneakers down to where the soles are going to be flapping soon. Autos are expensive! I have not had to make a car payment in 33 years.

    • NorwayviaOkinawa 3 years ago

      Solar has proven to be a total failure. Hello solyndra. This is all Democrat Commie bull being fed so you all will permit their continued theft and corruption. Where the eff is my jet pack!?!

      • Dazeez5555 3 years ago

        Agree. Electric cars subsidized by sales to government agencies, Tesla subsidized by US tax payers. These companies cannot survive on their own.

        • Garys_opinion 3 years ago

          As long as gasoline prices are low, and you don’t need them for anything but local driving.
          Hydrogen cars are the way to go, the exhaust is water. Hydrogen can be difficult to store because the molecule is so small that it’s hard to contain, there is also a big danger of explosion when mixed with oxygen.

          • Pumpkin King XXIII 3 years ago

            If electric become more and more popular than the demand for oil would decrease, that would drive the cost of gas down more causing a larger shift back to gas.
            Simple economics

          • bstoff 3 years ago

            Yes, but there will be a large cost for infrastructure change. It will be gradual as the market allows, just like oil-based fuels did.

          • Pat Patterson 3 years ago

            Hydrogen technology is a farce, maybe a hundred years.

        • terry rense 3 years ago

          Tesla received loans which they payed back in full with interest.

          • JerryP 3 years ago

            Tesla is indirectly subsidized by tax credits for buyers of electric vehicles. See IRS form 8936.

          • terry rense 3 years ago

            That credit has been around before Tesla was even formed. And if you get a Tesla 3 you most likely won’t get that tax credit.

          • Duocore2 3 years ago

            Ahhh….ya like the average working American can afford a Tesla.

          • terry rense 3 years ago

            The Model 3 is 35k. That’s about what the average Chevy sells for these days. All cars have gotten insanely expensive.

          • squirefld 3 years ago

            Did they pay back all of the subsidized tax money they got? That’s what they used to pay back their loans. Sounds like a ponzi scheme.

          • terry rense 3 years ago

            Did Exxon? Our AT&T? The tax money Tesla has received is pennies on the dollar compared to many household company names.

          • squirefld 3 years ago

            If your talking about Generally Accepted Accounting Principals, you are totally ignorant. Every company in the United States including Hershey Chocolate and the entire gun manufacturing industry gets depreciation and all legal write offs. Even people like you can write off mortgage interest. But Tesla has gotten 4.9 billion, in subsidies (real money) and he paid off a 465 million loan. He made a $4,465,000,000.00 profit from taxpayers.

          • Calamity_Jean 3 years ago

            And early!

      • Frank 3 years ago

        This is some red pill blue pill the whole universe is a virtual reality program Matrix nonsense. Public transportation is already a nightmare and ANYTHING the government subsidizes is an effort to oppress the prosperity of taxpayers wheter healthcare, auto and airline and business regulations forcing rates to be jacked up to comply or the gubmint printing press student loan monopoly ponzi scheme diluting the rarity and quality of any degree and making them more useless cause they graduate practically any student they indebt. We have a guvmint transportation subsidized boondoggle that would be bankrupt if not for the printing press just like the post office and already costing taxpayers aho knows how much to prop it up – its called AmTrak!

        • bstoff 3 years ago

          You’re right except the part about the Post Office. It is supported entirely by sales of postage. There is no tax support for Postal services.

      • fcabanski 3 years ago

        Originally, the idea was to have electric cars. Electric and steam powered cars were first. Then the internal combustion engine revolutionized the industry.

        Since combustion engines became popular, Progressives have been looking for ways to taking us back to government controlled transportation in impractical, inefficient vehicles.

      • bstoff 3 years ago

        I hope solar energy can eventually become efficient and affordable, it seems like where our future should be. But the government will make it useless if it controls it. Free energy belongs to individual people, not as a public, government-controlled monopoly.

    • glamdeluxe 3 years ago

      Sowell is great!

    • juanjeremy2012 3 years ago

      ITS NOT JUST LEFTISTS. THE LEFT -RIGHT THING IS A FACADE CREATED BY THE GLOBALISTS TO DISTRACT FROM THE REAL CONFLLICT WHICH IS BETWEEN THE 1%ERS (THE GLOBALISTS) AND THE 99%. BUT YOU ARE RIGHT THAT THEY ARE TRYING TO TAKE AWAY OUR CARS, OUR PRIVACY AND OUR ABILITY TO SHOP ANYWHERE BUT AMAZON IN ORDER TO CONTROL US. EVERYONE SHOULD STOP USING AMAZON AND UBER AND START TELLING THE GLOBALISTS TO SHOVE IT SO WE CAN HAVE SOME FREEDOM.

      • bstoff 3 years ago

        Not really the 1%-ers as much as the .01%-ers. They are the ones to worry about, but you will never see or hear anything about them in the public. They are all above people like Soros, who is really a puppet for them.

        • juanjeremy2012 3 years ago

          yes ur right it ismaybe even .001% ers–the real luciferian pschopaths like bezos, the rockefellars, rothschilds etc…

  21. Joseph Guidry 3 years ago

    If you support this you deserve to be a slave. I am going to make a bumper sticker, you want to take away my Mustang GT? You can pry it from my cold dead hands! There will be blood.

  22. TonyMonterey 3 years ago

    People who live in Cities think they have everything figured out for the rest of us. I foresee these things vandalized and arriving with with “surprises” of all sorts of things people execrate from their body. Utopia meets the Idiocracy.

    • mcc99 3 years ago

      Yeah. Practical solutions from urban settings frequently don’t translate to the needs of suburbanites or country folk. But urbanites often think they should or do for some strange reason.

      • Gilligan Jones 3 years ago

        …you don’t understand. They do not intend for there to be…”country folks”…as robotics will replace much of Big-Ag’s tasks and costs. It is much easier to program a robot to plant, tend and harvest a crop…than it is to employ a person…even if that person is illegally in the country.

    • Gilligan Jones 3 years ago

      ….the elites have developed Agenda 21, Agenda 35 and Agenda 50 with this exact vision in mind. Eliminate huge swaths of the population…(5-6 billion)… and then stack the rest of the economic slaves on top of each other in technologically -controlled cities…where their every move can be traced and tracked.

      • Nick 3 years ago

        You need to see a doctor.

        • PoliSike 3 years ago

          More hate from Nick.

        • Gilligan Jones 3 years ago

          …you need to educate yourself…or continue to cash those checks you get from the NWO for being a treasonous-troll. Oh, and as a 25 year veteran executive with US DoD…and the retired winner of a twenty-year Federal Whistle Blowing Case against DoD…I think I know much more about the corrupt actions of your government. You sound like an uninformed idiot.

    • Nick 3 years ago

      That’s where most people live, dumbass. If this is what city-dwellers do in 2030, then the headline will have been true.

      • PoliSike 3 years ago

        Again, Nick, why is your heart filled with so much hate?

      • bstoff 3 years ago

        That’s where all of your “friends” live. The cities are full of consumers and “useless eaters” like yourself. You belong there. Enjoy your utopian dream. Look up utopia in the dictionary. It might open your eyes.

  23. x32792 3 years ago

    When you factor in all the related expenses of buying and owning a car, they ain’t cheap and have very little residual value.

    • yarpos . 3 years ago

      For the utility and convenience provided they are cheap actually, unless you choose to continually buy new ego stroking models and fund the depreciation for everyone else.

  24. John B. French 3 years ago

    LOL yeah right…Anyone who thinks this will be the case in 13 years is loony..

    • Grand2833 3 years ago

      Absolutely true, such ridiculous nonsense is more than just unbelievable, it’s loony.

      • Ellis 3 years ago

        “Naaaaaayy” thats what the said about horses and steam shovels.

        • TroyGale 3 years ago

          We still have horses don’t we?

          • KevTuck 3 years ago

            They shoot horses, don’t they?

          • J Michael 3 years ago

            Depends on their age.

          • Dumpster 3 years ago

            Did they shoot all of them? No. We still have horses.

          • TroyGale 3 years ago

            One of the worst movies of all time.
            Shame on you…

          • glamdeluxe 3 years ago

            Only Hanoi Jane.

          • david333 3 years ago

            * What can be more palpably absurd than the prospect held out of locomotives traveling twice as fast as stagecoaches?
            * The Quarterly Review, March, 1825
            * That the automobile has practically reached the limit of its development is suggested by the fact that during the past year no improvements of a radical nature have been introduced.
            * Scientific American, January 2, 1909.

            * With over fifteen types of foreign cars already on sale here, the Japanese auto industry isn’t likely to carve out a big share of the market for itself
            * Businessweek, August 2, 1968.

          • fcabanski 3 years ago

            You’re missing something. Autonomous cars are a step backwards, not a step forward. They’re a step back to group, rather than individual, travel. Cars give people freedom to go when they want. They brought travel to the individuals. Now you want to take travel away from each person, put it in control of central planners.

            Cars became popular because of the individual freedom they afforded.

          • Nick 3 years ago

            They autonomous cars still take you wherever you want to go, you paranoid drudgetard.

          • PA-1 3 years ago

            Not if I have to wait for it.

          • PA-1 3 years ago

            Sometimes I don’t know where I want to go. I just want to..go,

          • phantasm 3 years ago

            At what cost? It will cost a lot more when Travel is a service. My car costs me a total of 150 a month for gas and about 25 a month for maintenance. It’s paid off so I don’t have to make payments anymore. But if you want to throw it in, I’ve owned the car for 10 years and it cost 20K so say about 165 a month. If you can guarantee me that I will pay less than 350 a month to go where I want, when I want for that cost or cheaper, then I’ll buy into it. Otherwise, no way in hell.

          • Burnt Orange 3 years ago

            Maybe families will own ONE auto for personal travel and utilize the new method for errands, travel to work and taking kids to school No need for two or three autos per family. The whole thing might be a compromise with integration of differing methods of travel. It might NOT be an either/or situation.

            That is until the government gets involved then the rules and orders start coming from Washington. Each nation will approach this thing with differing approaches depending on their cultures and economic situation.

          • PoliSike 3 years ago

            So much hatred. Why are you filled with so much hatred?

          • shannon henderson 3 years ago

            Because he’s a lefty. They are all filled with hatred. That is how they live. Drama queens.

          • Robert Bonaiuto 3 years ago

            I can’t wait for your auto car to get hacked and driven off a cliff. While it’s falling you’ll scream, ” I wish I had a chevy……ahhhhhhh”

          • Taluca Lake 3 years ago

            Wow. You’re really a sad person. You fail to consider the role of government in all of this.

          • Casey Kowalchyk 3 years ago

            Except when they drive you straight to the police station for whatever thought crimes are on the menu in 2030. Paranoid? People were called paranoid once for suggesting that intelligence agencies were using your computer and phone to spy on you. Today’s paranoiac is tomorrow’s prophet.

          • fcabanski 3 years ago

            They do? You don’t have to wait for them to arrive at your destination? They don’t refuse to take you to a bar, for example, if you have a warrant for drunken and disorderly conduct? They will never be regulated to restrict destinations for people?

          • shannon henderson 3 years ago

            You are right. You are absolutely right. And I’m SURE that list will go on and on. Hadn’t looked down that hole too much because I don’t have any intention of pursuing this.

          • bstoff 3 years ago

            Nick, your fantasy is just that. BTW, you forgot to type in ALL CAPS to serve as a warning to others.

          • shannon henderson 3 years ago

            You are now officially an idiot. 2 of your comments you are judging and mocking those that read drudge. Do you have anything else in that brain of yours or do you just try to put people down? Well, I guess that makes you a typical Lefty. Nothing to say so you make fun of people. You RACIST, HOMOPHOBIC, TRANSPHOBIC, BIGOT, SEXIST pig! Sorry sweet pea but EVERYTHING in life is a slippery slope. If it wasn’t then Newton’s 1st law of motion would be incorrect.

          • Billygoattincan 3 years ago

            The government won’t let you rent or ride in an autonomous until there are 6 of you going to the same destination. From there, you walk.

          • Evil Otto 3 years ago

            Mmm, that’s some good hatred. Delicious.

          • Shep😈✓ᵛᵉʳᶦᶠᶦᵉᵈ 3 years ago

            Yes.

          • Daniel Ramos 3 years ago

            Hey Shep…my Aunt Bernina would like you to check in on her. Be a good chap and say hi will you please?

          • Shep😈✓ᵛᵉʳᶦᶠᶦᵉᵈ 3 years ago

            Yes. Working on a merger. Still at office. We have a conference call and other work to do.

            I noticed her fence had panel blow out. I’ll take care of that as soon as I can.

          • Shep😈✓ᵛᵉʳᶦᶠᶦᵉᵈ 3 years ago

            Links for Antifa + Communists + Nambla

            https://www.google.com/search?q=antifa+communists+nambla&oq=antifa+communists+nambla&aqs=chrome..69i57.17000j0j7&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8

            It is pretty damning.

            The pages from the journal are absolutely disgusting.

          • Shep😈✓ᵛᵉʳᶦᶠᶦᵉᵈ 3 years ago

            Spoke with my son. It was the fence panel. He has already fixed it.

          • MovinToCanada 3 years ago

            * Americans will never be so pathetic as to choose dependency and limitation over freedom of travel

            I see your point

          • joesockit 3 years ago

            Look in the mirror, You are your parents. Self driving cars are the norm in the future. It will start in cities because there it makes sense. Where I see the risk is anything that upsets the grid now takes down even more infrastructure. An emp that takes out some GPS Satellites now wipes out all transportation, not just a few cars in a certain area. Battery range will also be an issue.

          • TAG 3 years ago

            I could get you one…

          • TroyGale 3 years ago

            I have some thanks!

          • Rusty Longwood 3 years ago

            Not many horses. Just a sliver of what we used to have. And most of those are kept for fun and sport. Just like we’ll have with cars.

          • TroyGale 3 years ago

            Don’t bet on it, not all of us live in cities.

          • BigDaddyJim 3 years ago

            Guess you’ll be part of the 40% they say will still own cars.

          • TroyGale 3 years ago

            More than 40%. People are becoming tired of living in the cesspools called major cities. That is being documented each year as those who can flee them.

          • Gilligan Jones 3 years ago

            ..I live in an area with hundreds of horses…a couple across the fence, five or six across the street…and barns or fields filled with them as I drive down the road a couple of miles from my home. And I live in Northern California…I’m sure there are many more in Texas, Oklahoma…etc…..

          • Burnt Orange 3 years ago

            Can you saddle one or put a bridal on a horse? They are NOT a part of everyday life. Autos might wind up the same — a curiosity or a collectors item.

          • Casey Kowalchyk 3 years ago

            I bridled a bit when I read this.

          • R_Swift 3 years ago

            BO is attempting to saddle us with government control, I for one demand he put a halter to this.

          • TroyGale 3 years ago

            Yes, I grew up with horses and mules in rural Pennsylvania. I have room for them on my place today, but don’t need the expense of keeping them. But I do know how to saddle and bridle a horse, and ride one too.
            And the Amish would disagree that the horse isn’t a part of everyday life. I see them every time I take a trip to Springfield, MO. Either with the family wagon, or working their fields.

          • Burnt Orange 3 years ago

            In case you did not GET IT I was referring to the average person. At one time most individuals could deal with taking care of a horse. Now not so much.

            Driving might go the way of the horse and buggy. And yes I know a very small percentage of people still utilize horses and buggies.
            A rhetorical question often does not seek an answer but is used as a way to illustrate a larger truth.
            The Amish are not even one half of one percent of the population of the USA.

          • TroyGale 3 years ago

            It isn’t rocket science, the average person has seen a movie with horses. It doesn’t take a College education to figure it out. Since there are millions of horses still in the U.S., there is enough folks to teach the helpless how to saddle and bridle them. The horse, nor the private vehicle won’t be vanishing anytime soon.

          • Burnt Orange 3 years ago

            Not sure the story said they would be vanishing but miles driven by drivers would be reduced by 90%. Headline overhypes story.
            My guess is individuals will probably own one auto for personal use while utilizing driverless services for some everyday trips around town and kids to school. No need for families with two or three autos. i agree that the private auto will not be going anyplace anytime soon. But changes are coming.

        • Neighbor2u 3 years ago

          Individuals owned horses and now individuals own cars.

          • zoomwhat 3 years ago

            And individuals now own cars, horses, and trucks and trailers to haul them.

          • ohiograndma 3 years ago

            My imagination is running wild. If the government mandated no private cars, I’m certain some other form of independent transportation would develop. Like… horses.

          • Leone 3 years ago

            I foresee us mandating the end of any government that outlaws private ownership of cars and trucks…We’ll restart this Republic from scratch first, my dear.

          • Mina 3 years ago

            got that right

          • soononbluray 3 years ago

            If? How can you even think like that? The government would never mandate no private cars. There would be a violent overthrow.

          • Taluca Lake 3 years ago

            Check out the cities that have “no car” zones. They effectively limit ownership. But fear not. As long as the UAW is contributing to democrats, there will be cars.

          • BigDaddyJim 3 years ago

            Public transportation and even corporate owned transportation services gives the government much more information on peoples movement and the ability to limit it when they choose.

          • Mina 3 years ago

            That is why their prediction won’t come true.

          • fcabanski 3 years ago

            That’s what people are missing. Cars give travel to the individuals. This self driving car concept takes control of travel away from individuals. It puts corporations and ultimately the government in more control of when and where people travel.

          • Nick 3 years ago

            The cars still take you where you want to go, tho. Better wrap another layer of aluminum foil around your head.

          • PoliSike 3 years ago

            Again, you can’t express yourself without the hate. Why all the hatred?

          • Taluca Lake 3 years ago

            He’s posting as part of his junior high civics class