The state has the right approach.
Convincing the network operators on frequency stabilisation will be one of the next tasks. I chatted briefly to a network economist on the plane this weekend, and this was a major immediate concern.
From your knowledge it seems it would be pertinent to link a list of battery storage householders into this endeavor.
I expect that what is needed a large number to ensure that this is able to provide a stable and reliable bank to draw on.
It’s sensible to have more storage in a high RE grid, but who’s getting the profit from home owners giving out their power for half the price of the wholesale market? Hopefully the SA gov can give us the rest of our deserved FiT via a battery subsidy
Eventually when smart metering allows retailers to buy power from your storage they will determine the FiT to encourage you to sell it.
Thats ok. In a sense battery incentive is a solar incentive.
Seems Koutsantonis wants to keep the fossil fuel retailers noses in the trough by ignoring the move by Victoria and the expected move in NSW to a fairer FIT.
FiTs should be priced higher than centrally-generated renewable which relies on a grid to transmit to a customer. The difference
Koutsantonis- you are a drop kick muppet. We are a de-facto couple on a D.S.P that found some seasonal work and slaved our guts out for over 3 years (after losing 50% of earned income back to Centrelink) saving to afford our solar system only to be getting back 8.2 cents F.I.T whilst paying 37.4 cents from our energy supplier, our average FIT deduction per quarter does not even cover the supply charge per quarter anymore. I believe if the well off could afford solar early and can be paid 44 cents per kWh exported to the grid until 30 June 2028 by the government, surely the rest of us strugglers could at least be given a fair price for our solar- similar to the eastern states in stead of nothing at all. The other option is a tiered price structure for solar battery storage subsidised by the government and structured on disposable income. Let me tell you it is pretty hard for a couple on D.S.P living on $35000 a year to afford anything else. I doubt we will be getting enough money from fair F.I.T’s to be happy still paying electricity bills, I still think we would rather be installing batteries if given a reasonable pricing structure and options.
If you substitute a good amount of grid electricity with your solar electricity, you will achieve substantial savings on your electricity bill; enough to make solar PV a much better investment than putting money in the bank.
Jo, you are absolutely correct. We usually export around 55-70% on a good day with plenty sunlight. Unfortunately that is only 4-5 months of the year. We are very happy to have gotten solar on the roof and it has made a big difference to the bills. We just don’t like being ripped off on the F.I.T, getting only 22% of the retail price of imported energy for our exported power, seems a bit shady too me
What happens at the other 8 months of the year?
And also what state are you in? There is a new retailer offering 10 cent/kWh.
According to Finn’s site Origin is offering 12c kWh in SA
https://www.solarquotes.com…
Richy
Read your inverter figures and your grid connected meter.
Your solar array puts out x amount of kwr and you import and export y and z amount of kwr.
Now sit down and work out the amount kwr your house has used from your inverter figures against the import and export.
As to the export amount at what ever few cents this is per kwr that is a gain.
The base situation is the difference between your production as against your export is your gain do you follow me?
The easiest way is to look on the power bill. The amount of power used (imported) from the energy supplier and the amount of solar put back in the grid (exported). We keep daily records of solar harvested by our system and are aware that the 24 hour usage will be made up of both imported and solar energy.
But what I am saying is say we just exported 900kwh of solar (last quarter) at .082 cent per kwh we earn $73.80 per quarter and daily supply charges are .87879 cents per day.
Quarterly bills equal around 91 days on average.
This equates to 91 days of supply charges = $79.97
Solar exported back to the grid = $73.80
Difference = $6.17 still owing on supply charges.
Like I said with these poor F.I.T rates in S.A we don’t even cover our supply charges per quarter.
This is not the best way to look at it. The feed in tariff is not meant to pay your daily supply charges.
I suggest to actually keep supply charges out of the consideration unless you compare different retailers.
Use the savings on electricity from the grid by solar as well as the feed-in income combined to give you an average savings per solar kWh which you can use as the base of your assessment.
I can provide a spreadsheet for that if some is interested.
Jo, your post has garnered lots of replies, that’s fantastic. Here’s my take: t. The difference between your ongrid system and an off grid system is you have the grid and the off gridder has batteries and maybe a backup generator. You are in effect using the grid as storage and backup. If you can do better with your own battery/backup system then that’s great, but if not then that’s just tough. You’d have to use more political and other avenues to get your costs down, good luck with that!
We don’t need minimum mandated FiTs. As the wholesale prices rise retail competition in SA will steadily increase the FiTs in the market. You can already get 12c in SA. Expect 16c+ soon.
Who is paying 12c Finn? I think Diamond are paying 11c and their daily supply charge seems OK.
I’m just waiting for my next credit to hit my bank before pulling the pin on AGL
bang your postcode in this tool – then check the box that says ‘Sort by FiT (highest first)’ and you’ll see the current best FiTs:
https://www.solarquotes.com.au/energy/
Origin and Click Energy at the moment are best
Interesting tool… however, the quarterly prices are pretty useless without being able to enter the PV exports.
In any case the order of things to achieve savings on a quarterly bill is: 1. low daily supply charge; 2. maximise self-consumption, 3. look for highest FiT.
You can enter the PV exports simply hit the big orange button that says ‘enter details from your bill here >>’. It appears after you enter your postcode and hit the green button
Thanks for that Finn. The Origin plan looks like it will suit me very nicely assuming they allow SA tier one FiT customers.
Finn, your assertions are based on the operation of a pure market. We all know that the electricity sector in characterised by highly flawed even failed markets.
We know that companies selling complex products like mobile phone plans, superannuation products and retail electricity packages are adept at some equally complex marketing ploys designed to obfuscate and confuse the unwary.
Retail electricity packages probably take the cake for opacity in structure to the ordinary consumer with tariff structures, discounts etc seemingly designed for one purpose only – to confuse.
I doubt that your data provides a reliable means of fairly comparing packages for individual consumers. If not, we at Solar Citizens SA and even the Essential Services Commission of SA who won’t even rely on the government energymadeeasy website for comparing plans for solar owners would be delighted to examine it!
More than happy for you guys to examine it. The good thing about it: you can enter details from a previous bill and see if your new bill with each plan would be higher or lower.
One thing it does not include is TOU plans.
Also some of the FiTs are based on buying a new system from the retailer. I’m looking how to remove those from the feed.
Wouldn’t the offer of a premium FIT to SA households during peak load periods encourage them to invest in battery storage and export to the grid at those times. Wouldn’t this save the SA Government from having to fund so much grid level battery storage? No smarts or no smart meters?
There is a staged rollout of smart meters happening. Not mandatory.
Also time of use rates would be needed I would think and these are also voluntary at the moment.
The meters wouldn’t have to be too smart. The old economy tariff 33 or 31 could be repurposed for battery households. ie lower rates but for a limited guaranteed supply time each day.
I can be convinced by reason. And this sounds reasonable.
Regarding EV to Grid, be aware that Tesla does not support this. A previous Renew Economy article quoted CTO JB Staubel’s reasoning behind Tesla being unlikely to go this way – see https://reneweconomy.wpengine.com/tesla-explains-evs-selling-electricity-grid-not-good-sounds-47156/
People call it unfair to be paid 5c/kWh for electrical energy fed in to the grid. The problem is that the system doesn’t want our electricity at any time we care to provide it. They want it when they need it and will pay for it. This means storage and the licence to draw on it when needed. Furthermore, by raising the feed-in tariff, the energy providers are creating a dis-incentive to install batteries.
A previous article says SA on a good renewables generation day over a poor demand period can already be close to 100% renewables, plus there is another 1GW renewables in the construction phase. This means that all this capacity, and household solar will be competing for grid exports.
South Australia needs interconnectivity with its (laggard) neighbours and it needs storage. Why not help households along with battery storage?
Either in the form of subsidising price directly or setting up a bulk buy cooperative or by creating generous FiT’s for high wholesale price periods. Or by setting up a home battery tariff with very cheap rates but peak demand time interruptions.
This last point could see a rate of 10c/ KWh or so, but no supply between 6 am to 8am and 6pm and 9pm for example.
This article starts by implying that SA doesn’t want to pay a fair price. Surely it’s possible to pay a fair price that is structured so as to provide an incentive to install storage and to have it configured to deliver to the grid when it is most needed. In fact, if they don’t pay a fair price then residents will be far less motivated to invest in storage.
And if a large chunk of generation comes from rooftop systems rather than being payed to big companies, then that is money that stays in the state, which would surely have a positive effect on the SA economy.
Looking at this article, and many others from RE in the last few months, it seems renewables have finally thrown off the pall of uncertainty, deliberately cast by the mad monk and his deranged band of followers.
Crack on and show the world how solar and wind ( and storage, let’s not forget storage) can change society and rapidly overthrow the imbedded incumbents.
And if you can provide an interconnecter to deliver sunshine to Northen England, it would be greatly appreciated-:)
Batteries are going to be the death knell to price gouging incumbents
The minister for White Elephants wants to install some dodgy 250MW gas turbine that is only going to run in emergencies… I hope they are going to locate right next door to the desal plant… Tom has absolutely no concept of how battery storage works at a household level. If you do not value my surplus energy appropriately and I’m forced to store it, there is no way I’m going to make it dispatch-able, in fact I’ll encourage and advocate we go the other way completely – off the grid or to the edge of the grid. The only positive I could take from the round table was he’s considering incentive’s for battery storage… but does he realise that there is no Australian Standard for lithium batteries yet????
Worth pointing out that SA rooftop solar’s dispatch weighted price is 11 cents/kWh over the last few months. That said I like the idea of a lower export price as it encourages battery use.